Comments
JohnnyS777 • December 25, 2024 7:18 PM
The kind of people and organizations that can afford to use Pegasus aren’t going to care one way or the other.
Since Pegasus is not based in the USA, this legal finding is not going to affect them in any way.
So a few lawyers get paid, and nothing else changes. Even the tinfoil hat brigade thinks this is a waste of time.
Clive Robinson • December 26, 2024 12:36 PM
@ JohnnyS777, ALL,
With regards,
“Since Pegasus is not based in the USA, this legal finding is not going to affect them in any way.”
I disagree, even though the finding is not what we would like, and NSO are not a US organisation you have to consider several things.
Firstly the US can and has acted against non US companies that have not acted in US Jurisdiction.
The reason is that the US especially the State Dept consider their writ to be global (something that will continue to come back and bite).
The thing is that the US is far from impartial in such matters and whilst the NSO might only get a Tsk, tsk, any company from a range of countries will get hammered as “a matter of policy”. We’ve seen this already happen in other commercial areas in Europe for instance.
But Secondly, consider weak as it is it has in effect “set president” and thus is if you like
“The first step on the journey”.
I should imagine that several people are “spitting teeth” over it because of this alone, and as TechDirt note it’s almost entirely down to NSO defying the court,
When monetary damages are decided, then NSO can decide not to pay up. However there is a resolution process that falls under the Inter State Resolution. Which means that the government of the country NSO are formally resident in falls liable. And if pushed the process can make it eye-wateringly expensive for the Government concerned and oh so much easier for other Companies to go for that source of money from then on.
The fact that many suspect NSO is in effect a cut out or front for the government concerned is likely to increase the pain point.
lurker • December 27, 2024 12:08 PM
@Clive Robinson
re “Inter State Resolution”
It ain’t gonna happen here. Consider who the other state is, and the US general attitude to international dispute resolution, and who will be pushing the buttons in two weeks time.
More likely is that NSO will find they hav standing to appeal this to a higher court. Whether the Supremes will interpret CFAA the same as Judge Hamilton is an interesting question.
Steve • December 27, 2024 12:57 PM
This case reminds me of those toothless “indictments” of Russian hackers that will never come to more than a press release and a half day of a news cycle.
Like the International Criminal Court “arrest warrants” for Putin, Netanyahu, et al, it’s all just pointless bureaucratic posturing.
ResearcherZero • December 29, 2024 3:38 AM
@Clive Robinson, JohnnyS777, ALL
NSO is not the only company looking to land contracts in the U.S. and abroad.
Exploiting grievances for fun and profit…
‘https://www.irishtimes.com/world/us/2024/12/23/palantir-partners-with-leading-defence-and-tech-companies-to-win-us-government-contracts/
The tech lobby also wants to remove corporate oversight.
https://www.wired.com/story/cisa-cuts-trump-2/
The produced intelligence products contain a wealth of valuable information.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2013/jun/16/gchq-intercepted-communications-g20-summits
ResearcherZero • December 29, 2024 4:15 AM
@Clive Robinson
A good example of what you are talking about comes from a case involving the AIPAC group.
Espionage law can be interpreted narrowly to suit particular interests…
‘https://fas.org/publication/ruling_in_aipac_case_interpret/
What kind of access does AIPAC have?
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2024/05/02/what-is-aipac-meaning/73542842007/
Members may have access to classified information.
https://archive.lewrockwell.com/ips/lobe122.html
When is a spy not a spy and when has someone done something they should have not?
Someone who ends up wearing the blame of course.
https://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/20/politics/pentagon-analyst-gets-12-years-for-disclosing-data.html
ResearcherZero • January 3, 2025 12:38 AM
There are no independent governments. Corporations write our legislation. They dictate the terms, fund the candidates, all the while neglecting safety and procedure. If your house burns down because of a wildfire, it is often corporate cost-cutting that has lead up to the chain of events that made it possible. Poor maintenance of power lines, faulty water pipes, inspectors faking reports, and years of rotten corporate culture which ignored it.
By the time there is enough public pressure for government to act, the cat is out of the bag. There are an entire line of products to monitor and keep whistleblowers quiet. Plenty of laws that can lead to their prosecution, and a completely imbalanced legal system.
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Buggy • December 24, 2024 3:52 PM
But, but … our TOS says you’ll pink-swear that you’ll do no evil with our software that facilitates evil. We’re the good guys selling digital Sarin gas.