Speaking to the CIA’s Creative Writing Group

This is a fascinating story.

Last spring, a friend of a friend visited my office and invited me to Langley to speak to Invisible Ink, the CIA’s creative writing group.

I asked Vivian (not her real name) what she wanted me to talk about.

She said that the topic of the talk was entirely up to me.

I asked what level the writers in the group were.

She said the group had writers of all levels.

I asked what the speaking fee was.

She said that as far as she knew, there was no speaking fee.

What I want to know is, why haven’t I been invited? There are nonfiction writers in that group.

Tags: books, CIA

Posted on January 19, 2024 at 7:21 AM • 19 Comments

Comments

Clive Robinson • January 19, 2024 8:11 AM

@ Bruce,

Re : Small talk side channels.

“What I want to know is, why haven’t I been invited?”

Possibly because you are as Yogi used to say,

“Smarter than the average bear”.

Look at it this way, you know, all conversation is a Shannon Communications Channel, and Shannon and Simmons work showed that,

1, All channels have covert channels
2, The only way to stop information leaking is not to communicate.

Thus they may figure on your published writting and this blog, it’s best not to let you within Tempest range 😉

seth godin • January 19, 2024 8:12 AM

It’s a good story. And don’t worry about not being invited–it’s a lot of hassle for a coffee mug.

The real challenge, apropos of the blog, is the security. Instead of simply having the only the secret agents be secret, they make everyone who works there conceal useless things. So you end up with a bureaucracy that’s needlessly paranoid about things that don’t matter.

And trust plummets as a result. Trust in oneself, first and foremost.

With low trust, collaboration is harder to find.

K.S. • January 19, 2024 8:17 AM

“Which suggests CIA lawyers are more nuanced literary critics than half of Goodreads”

Haha!

Anonymous • January 19, 2024 10:08 AM

Creative writing group at the CIA? I thought they would have an AI for that by now.

Mr. Peed Off • January 19, 2024 10:48 AM

“I thought they would have an AI for that by now.”
The bots all failed the background check. Security was not amused by hallucinations on the background forms.

Erdem Memisyazici • January 19, 2024 11:05 AM

Would you really want to? If it’s the fame you care for I think you have a better reputation.

Back when I was a youngster and interested in the CIA I found out that it consists of nothing but good causes such as eliminating human trafficking across continents and bringing cellphones to poor areas around the world. But if you read history a lot of bad has also happened by the CIA (I don’t say that lightly). In fact most people see the organization as the latter and not the brainchild of the organization that defeated the Nazis.

Either way in my opinion Bruce Schneier is a genius, a historical figure (you designed twofish, so you’re in history), a freethinker, and provides a platform for commentary to promote freedom of speech.

CIA is polarizing by nature but then again a doctor goes where he/she is needed so maybe you can ask to be invited?

mark • January 19, 2024 12:27 PM

I see, so they wanted a writer to come in and talk about writing, but they couldn’t tell them about what, because they didn’t have the clearance to know.

And they wanted it for free. Right.

Have I missed anything?

Clive Robinson • January 19, 2024 5:50 PM

@ Mark,

“Have I missed anything?”

Yup, they probably did not want the “guest” talking about it…

But I guess even the CIA does not get every thing on it’s list 😉

I’ve given talks to spooks in times past, and I’ve given the same talk to sledge hammer wielding signallers… I’m sure there are others “reading along” who can say similar.

But who realy wants to know about setting up “Safety Earth” bonding that are also Red/Black –or Red/green depending on the side of the puddle you are on– seperated, it’s dull dull dull.

The most exciting thing was to say,

“This lecture is clasified as unclasified”

Something in the UK you can nolonger say…

wascaw • January 19, 2024 6:26 PM

It’s almost been 9 years since your last Movie-Plot Threat Contest, which you started 9 years prior…

What I want to know is, why haven’t I been invited?

Surely, you knew that someone else would take up the mantle! 🤠

Clive Robinson • January 19, 2024 6:38 PM

@ Bruce,

Re : Ninjas at 8 o’clock…

“There are nonfiction writers in that group.”

How do you know?
Who told you?
Were you read in?
Is anybody eavesdropping?

It’s been only half joked that every thing the CIA writes is a fiction…

But officially that is oh so tippy toppy secret 😉

It’s like the old joke from Russia,

Two inmates of the gulag talk for the first time, and as with all prisoners the question arises of why they are incarcerated.

The first says he kicked a police horse and was given 20years hard labour.

The second says he has not got a clue why he is in for life.

The first looks surprised and says, ‘well what did you do for a living?’

To which the second said he was a commedian and had been dragged off of the stage during the middle of his act and clubbed unconcious, and woke up in the gulag, and nobody would tell him why.

The first asks ‘What was the joke you were telling at the time?’

To which the comedian says he had made comment on a news headline and that the President was a complete idiot…

To which the first prisoner nods wisely and says “Of course, of course that explains it.’ To which the comedian says ‘Explains what?’ To which the first man says, ‘It’s obvious you were revealing state secrets’…

Ground Bounce • January 19, 2024 7:02 PM

Lets just not forget this type of organizations (Spooks, Intelligence Agencies) are criminal organizations, who murder people. Everyone who worked or collaborated for them have blood on their hands. Lets just don’t forget about that. Now write a novel.

Bell-Lapaula • January 20, 2024 6:28 PM

An anonymous source assures me you were invited, but not cleared for disclosure at that level of access. Write Up, Read Down.

SpaceLifeForm • January 22, 2024 10:19 PM

Lots of Badgers

“Didn’t it seem strange to you to get a second badge when you’d just got your first one?”

“I’ve never been here before,” I said. “Everything seems strange to me.”

A different cop told him to give it a rest, handed me a third badge, and asked if I needed directions to VIP parking. I have a terrible sense of direction—I once got lost at Costco for so long that they had to call my mom over the PA; I was fifteen—and Google Maps isn’t much use at Langley.

The nice cop said that I needed to turn right and follow the road until the sixth left. There I would see a line of squad cars and a gate, where my badge would swipe me in.

“If you see a helicopter, you’ve gone too far,” he said. “Just loop back around. Don’t make a U-turn.”

Clive Robinson • January 23, 2024 5:37 AM

@ SpaceLifeForm,

Nice to hear from you, you’ve been a bit quite of late, I hope for enjoyable reasons.

Back in the 1980’s I had a high security clearence ID badge that had all sorts of dire warnings of what might happen to you if you lost it (enough to make “hanging, drawing, and quatering” sound tame).

The thing is I was obviously not to be trusted, because it had a marker on it that said I was “to be accompanied at all times”. So not as much fun as being a toddler in a Mall, because being an adult you did not have the stress relief of a good old fashioned “Whal-ha” style screaming fit.

The problem was that all to often my clearance and the place I had to go within an installation was above that of the “chaperone”. The rules involved were to put it politely more than arduous…

In one place security was such that the “chaperone” had to push a device that looked like a floor polisher that had a swirling light and emitted loud warning “blorts” so people knew we were in the corridor etc and should ensure that shut their doors and hid behind them… So I got a “feel like a leper complex” ={

But worse was when I got to where I was going to work often the chaperone would have to stay outside the room… If there was nobody in the room it was not so bad… But getting the “hairy eyeball” from people with no sense of humor and side arms tended to make me feel twitchy.

But if the chaperone was of a lower security clearance, you found that “Write down and Read up” had a whole different meaning… You were not alowed to talk… Every thing had to be written on “carbon copy duplicate numbered recipts”. Which the chaperone had one of those clock punches that embossed the date and time… When you left you had to hand your copies back into the security office and get that “naughty child” feeling as you had to stand infront of the “officers desk” whilst he not only checked they lined up but went through what was written line by line…

Not the sort of place to have a “nervous bladder” or other medical condition or just need the other basic necesities in life. Just getting a cup of tea was a night mare and to have someone stand there watching you when you went to the loo…

I actually earned the wrath of my boss one day, because I said I wanted “Danger Money” he muttered something along the lines of “don’t worry they wont shot you” to which I replied, that being shot was survivable so did not worry me, but not being able to take a p155 all day put me in danger of an exploding bladder and that could kill me… He was less than amused when he realised I was not joking.

I’d like to look back and smile and say something like “Ahhh happy days” but no, there was very definately no happy there only grim or worse.

SpaceLifeForm • January 26, 2024 8:36 PM

@ Clive, JonKnowsNothing

I am pretty sure that I had something in the past month that was not Covid.

Horrible nasal congestion though.

Lots of sleep and water. Took weeks to clear.

My immune system has always been good, and I have been exposed to Covid for 4 years now (daily basis), so I have high confidence that the J and J vax I got almost 4 years ago is still working.

The only vax I ever got.

You may recall that I picked J and J because of the way it was designed.

Clive Robinson • January 27, 2024 4:57 AM

@ SpaceLifeForm, JonKnowsNothing,

Glad to here from you both.

“I am pretty sure that I had something in the past month that was not Covid.”

I’ve likewise been quite unwell and more or less housebound due to problems with the feet and lower legs for about 10months now, and why on monday I am going in for surgery…

The medical proffession have variously blaimed the “Type II” and what once was called “Congestive Heart failure”. But other things are wrong so I suspect “Knee Jerk” and “Fob-Off” as the actuall reasons for the suspect diagnoses.

However I had Oxford AZ and although fine with the first jab and leaving the longest alowable time before the second I got poleaxed.

You might remember I ended up way less than a month later nearly dead with only 5% cardiac output…

On trying to get the third shot booster as we were all getting told to do, every center I went to looked me up on the computer and said “You MUST talk to your doctor and GET a letter”.

Well getting to see the Dr was problematical and thus I did not get the letter or as a consequence that third jab (something since the “yellow card” scandle I’m gratefull for as it means I’ve avoided Pfizer, which like you I was suspicious of due to their production being entirely different to that used during test).

But my health has certainly degraded. A small cut on my leg which should have cleared in a week is still with me, and the ingrowing toenails are bad news as well… Lets just say my use of antibiotics is like the “fat kid in the sweety shop”…

I can not say if the vax is to blaim or not but getting rid of the toe nails will rule out one alternative…

Any way I shall keep leaving posts as “Proof of Life” 😉

JonKnowsNothing • January 27, 2024 9:43 AM

@ SpaceLifeForm, @Clive, All

We have raging COVID in California but you wouldn’t know it if you didn’t hunt for the data (ahem) from the CDC (better late than never).

We also have the Triple-demic of COVID, RSV, Flu and a bunch of add-ons, including old diseases that are making big come-backs because of low-no-vax for them in the population. Some of those are Coming Soon(tm) to your neighborhood.

We only had 2 choices this year both mRNA versions. The good news is they dropped the bivalent version for a monovalent version. Meaning, they dropped out more of the vax targeting extinct versions of COVID and kept only the portion of the vaccine targeting the most recent extinct version. Note the importance of Extinct Version…

We have a problem with our RAT (rapid antigen test) which cannot detect JN1 for an additional 4 days or so after symptoms. Lots of wand waving there, but the bottom line (ahem) is that the ID sequencing for JN1 is not in the RAT test (currently).

I am still COVID free, however the probability of remaining that way diminishes with each government pronouncement. In California, it is OK to send COVID positive children to school and for COVID positive people to be in F2F work situations. Can’t have the abattoirs stop.

I have a defective gene causing my bone marrow to turn to muck. To offset some of the damage caused by the misshapen blood components (inflammation), I take a very expensive an immune suppressant drug (paid for through a charity program). I am sort of a walking cytokine storm without it. Of course, the tiny problem of what happens when my body stops making blood cells is a looming eventuality.

Every trip outside, to the market, to the petrol station, to the post office could be my last outing. Every person who wants to come visit, might be my last visitor. It’s rather a difficult place to be.

I am most grateful to @Clive, @SpaceLifeForm and all the other posters for giving me a place to exchange knowledge and to learn from a variety of people on all sorts of topics, an interaction that preserves my health and expands the horizon.

@Clive, I hope that all goes well.

===

ht tps ://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myelofibrosis

Primary myelofibrosis (PMF) is a rare bone marrow blood cancer.
most often associated with a somatic mutation in the JAK2, CALR, or MPL genes.
The underlying cause of PMF is almost always related to an acquired mutation in JAK2, CALR or MPL in a hematopoietic stem/progenitor cell in the bone marrow.

Clive Robinson • January 27, 2024 11:26 AM

@ JonKnowsNothing, SpaceLifeForm, Winter, ALL,

“I am most grateful to @Clive, @SpaceLifeForm and all the other posters for giving me a place to exchange knowledge and to learn from a variety of people on all sorts of topics, an interaction that preserves my health and expands the horizon.”

I’m glad we can be of help, and thanks to our host @Bruce, for providing a “den to chat” and subjects to discuss, and @Moderator for keeping it clean and tidy.

Just trying to read all the comments can be a near full time job from time to time, and with thinking about reply’s…

(yes and @Winter has accused me today of bringing pleasure to swine hopefully nobody will complain I need to think of a suitable retort though 😉

I wish you all well and long may we all be wrestlers of the beasts of iniquity.

“@Clive, I hope that all goes well.”

So do I, but in honesty they are going to get “medieval on my toe-nails”… with instruments only a little better than something you might find in an old dungeon, and then only a little better for the person holding them not the recipient of such care ={

Hears hoping or should it be hopping the local anesthetic and “sound proofing” works or otherwise at 300m/S you’ll hear the screaming about 8hours and 15m after they start (if the airmiles calculator distance is right 😉

I’m determind to take life “one grumble at a time” for as long as there are reasons to grumble 😉

All the best to you all, and long may we all have cause to rail at the world, otherwise what pleasure would there be?

Winter • January 27, 2024 11:49 AM

@Clive

yes and @Winter has accused me today of bringing pleasure to swine

Pigs are intelligent creatures. Bringing them joy is a virtue.[1]

[1] I’ve stopped eating them.

Schneier on Security

Speaking to the CIA’s Creative Writing Group

Comments

Leave a comment Cancel reply