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December 13, 2018 2:01 PM

VinnyG on Your Personal Data is Already Stolen:

@Clive re: first into the breach - A long, long time ago, before the WWW, I was on a forum called BIX (short for Byte Information Exchange.) Some who know me might be shocked to know how reticent I was to offer an opinion there, because the average BIX member was probably significantly more intelligent than I, and there were a number of real genius-level people about. Jerry Pournelle and Jane Dow (architect of the Commodore Amiga) were two examples of typical "Bixen." Anyway, one BIX member, a Lt. Col. William Clardy (ret) had a suggestion on politicians that for me resonates with your...

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December 13, 2018 1:41 PM

VinnyG on Friday Squid Blogging: Problems with the Squid Emoji:

@Echo re: changing historical events and keeping Hitler from power - The problem with the "changing history" scenario, as amusing as it is in an SF novel, is that no one knows or (probably) could ever know what evil alternatives might result from such a change. Hitler was an evil madman, and caused the murder of millions of people, yet here we remain, and, in spite of many doomsayers, the current world is imo reasonably pleasant to inhabit. My reading indicates that the environment that facilitated Hitler and the Third Reich resulted largely from unreasonable and highly punitive measures...

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December 13, 2018 12:34 PM

Tristan on Marriott Hack Reported as Chinese State-Sponsored:

These attributions are something I've questioned for a long time. If a group of hackers is smart enough to penetrate hardened defences, aren't they going to be smart enough to leave a trail pointing to someone else? Everyone now talks about Russian hackers interfering in the US elections (and elsewhere), but what is the evidence that they are Russian, and is it conclusive?

December 13, 2018 12:22 PM

Clive Robinson on Marriott Hack Reported as Chinese State-Sponsored:

@ Bruce,

I used to have opinions about whether these attributions are true or not. These days, I tend to wait and see.

The evidence against many atributions is at best hearsay, thus it's best to be skeptical at the best of times.

@ All,

But when I read,

    Private investigators looking into the breach have found hacking tools, techniques and procedures previously used in attacks attributed to Chinese hackers, said three sources who were not authorized to discuss the company's private probe into the...

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December 13, 2018 11:49 AM

VRK on New Australian Backdoor Law:

"Aus Backdoor" sounds like Bill C-51:

" ...to take measures, within or outside Canada, to reduce a threat to the security of Canada... ...the judge may issue a warrant authorizing the persons...

(a) to enter any place or open or obtain access to any thing;
(b) to search for, remove or return, or examine, take extracts from or make copies of or record in any other manner the information, record, document or thing;
(c) to install, maintain or remove any thing; or
...

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December 13, 2018 11:32 AM

CallMeLateForSupper on New Australian Backdoor Law:

Re: "[...] it seems that the Australian government, like the Trump one or THE BREXIT CROWD IN BRITAIN, are not interested in listening to experts." (emphasis mine)

I would point out that assigning Brexit crowd to own all the Stupid gives undue cover to the geniuses who rammed through the Snoopers' Charter.

December 13, 2018 10:26 AM

Security Sam on Marriott Hack Reported as Chinese State-Sponsored:

While both public and private hostile foreign entities
Work day and night nonstop to steal our own identities
Our very own elected government came up with Real ID
That sets up tempting personal data banks in our cities.

December 13, 2018 9:46 AM

Cassandra on New Australian Backdoor Law:

@Sam

Having publicly available clear and cogent descriptions of the failings of the intended policies and actions is a benefit, even if they are ignored. People cannot say that they were not told, and have to defend their wilful ignorance. History is a judge with a long memory.

Being ignored is an occupational hazard, but not everyone who hears your message necessarily ignores it.

Cassandra

December 13, 2018 9:26 AM

vas pup on Friday Squid Blogging: Japanese Squid-Fishing Towns in Decline:

@Clive Robinson:
"We have already caught several MPs and Ministers on the take / kick back / cash for questions to US and US backed companies that want to get into UK Health Care and {violently] rape it like [a child]they have in the US..."
Clive I put some additions in brackets, because you have no way to fight against - like a child, and it affects you health dramatically - violently.

December 13, 2018 9:19 AM

TRX on New Australian Backdoor Law:

> Why are laws passed that are not adequately defined?

That's their whole *point*. A vague law lets the State interpret it in whatever way is most advantageous for them at the time.

Few laws are any more specific than they have to be, by design.

December 13, 2018 9:14 AM

vas pup on 2018 Annual Report from AI Now:

@all: I am in process of reading report. There are good suggestions that I agree upon, e.g. standardization of requirements for AI training data set.
Regarding other, e.g. if you know that women reoffend less than man and apply gender parameter to train AI separately for both subsets, then by the same token why you could not train AI separately to predict reoffending by race?
I am afraid that current tendency of political correctness will override real science and AI prediction/evaluation in particular challenging math as base for decision making.
Science (any) is...

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December 13, 2018 8:57 AM

RG-2 on Friday Squid Blogging: Problems with the Squid Emoji:

Physicist linked to China 2025 program

A noted Chinese-born physicist and Stanford University scientist Zhang Shoucheng, 55 who died Dec. 1 was linked to Beijing’s major program to corner the world market in key advanced quantum technologies.

“Guo Wengui, an exiled Chinese businessman who in the past had close contacts with Chinese intelligence, said he knew Zhang for years and doubted he died in a suicide.
“I knew this guy very well,” Mr. Guo told Inside the Ring. “The guy worked with the [Chinese Communist Party].”

In a broadcast on his internet video...

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December 13, 2018 8:44 AM

Ian on Marriott Hack Reported as Chinese State-Sponsored:

Lack of leaked tools just indicates that China/Russia are better at OpSec than the US. It does not indicate that they are not as prolific in their cyber attacks.

December 13, 2018 8:32 AM

Phaete on Marriott Hack Reported as Chinese State-Sponsored:

How possible scenarios turn into propaganda.
I'm getting a hint of a coming "Cyber weapons of Mass Destruction" campaign modeled after the successful lie that lets people invade other countries to takeover their resources.

If you read the articles, both attribs are thin, the chinese one and especially the state sponsored one.
Yet frighteningly many people hear it as gospel, and some news organisations dramatise it for their own gain.

I'm still not convinced that either China or Russia is anywhere as active in state sponsored worldwide hacking as the USA is....

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December 13, 2018 8:10 AM

Glen on Marriott Hack Reported as Chinese State-Sponsored:

We better get used to the fact that China is targeting our infrastructure.
Similarly, Kaspersky is targeting us for Russia (not an antivirus, but a virus/).

I can't believe people are still using Kaspersky and Huawei... not that this would help against such attacks on our private companies. But at least don't bring it home with you.

December 13, 2018 7:29 AM

metaschima on New Australian Backdoor Law:

@ Clive Robinson
I totally agree with you. The purpose of the legislation is to spy on the average citizen. It will force more knowledge people to like you said move the security endpoint off of insecure systems. It is good to know this so you can plan ahead. I will be interested to see how exactly they implement and enforce these new rules. I expect that if they somehow pull it off other countries will also adopt these measures.

December 13, 2018 7:25 AM

Sam on New Australian Backdoor Law:

@Cassandra

The LNP ignored the PJCIS report, recommendations, amendments, and forced the bill through using their numbers and the impending 'threat' of terrorist attacks over the next few months.

Forcing the major opposition party to withdraw any recommendations from the PJCIS, Senate, by closing down the Lower House at 4:30 and deciding not to return to Parliament for 10 weeks.

Tony Burke, MP sums up the LNP's actions just before 4:30 when they shut down the Lower House....

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December 13, 2018 5:51 AM

Cassandra on New Australian Backdoor Law:

@Bruce Schneier , @Ross Anderson

Thank-you for writing to the Australian Government Parliamentary Joint Committee on Intelligence and Security (PJCIS) regarding the TELECOMMUNICATIONS AND OTHER LEGISLATION AMENDMENT (ASSISTANCE AND ACCESS) BILL 2018.

While it may seem as though you are talking to people who will not listen, putting your points across as you have done in a clear, polite, and articulate fashion helps the debate. I greatly appreciate the trouble you have taken to do so.

Your letter acts as a good reference for other people, and not just for the...

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December 13, 2018 4:20 AM

Clive Robinson on New Australian Backdoor Law:

@ Ismar,

enacting of these laws can only mean an attempt of weakening of the democracy itself as the healthy democracy depends on the ability of the people to make decisions in private without fear of retribution.

Yes that's the viewpoint have sensibly arived at.

Where there is a little disagreement is who is calling the shots. Many think it's the politicians, but as you note,

This will, I fear, will be proven in not so distant future when we realise these measures managed to net ZERO criminals while degrading our ability to keep...

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December 13, 2018 3:53 AM

Ross Anderson on New Australian Backdoor Law:

Bruce and I, and a number of crypto and security colleagues, did write a letter to the relevant joint committee of the Australian parliament, but it seems that the Australian government, like the Trump one or the Brexit crowd in Britain, are not interested in listening to experts.

December 13, 2018 3:15 AM

Ismar on New Australian Backdoor Law:

As an Australian I have a higher than usual interest in this and here is my 5 cents worth.
The criminals (and this includes a broad range including what authorities call terrorists) have long been aware of the vulnerability of the digital communications and as such use other means of organising their nefarious activities (at least those with higher than average IQ which are the ones we should be scared of the most).
Those in the government agencies who care about democracy (and I still think there are some left) must be aware of this as well.
By the process of...

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December 13, 2018 3:13 AM

recherche on New Australian Backdoor Law:

The rebuttal is hilarious, for all the wrong reasons.

Two examples:

-----------------------

Myth #6: ASD will be able to spy on Australians
The Australian Signals Directorate is a foreign intelligence agency. It does not collect the communications of everyday Australians.
  1. The body says everyday Australians, yet the title says "spy on Australians". The title is misleading. Anyway, how is an UnEveryday Australian defined?

  2. If the ASD stumbles upon an...

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December 13, 2018 12:00 AM

Thoth on New Australian Backdoor Law:

@all

Well, "Good" for the AUS/NZ region in a not so nice way (sarcastic).

I have begun reviewing any affected modules to implement workarounds in my business settings to ensure my clients get unaffected cryptographic modules.

It is only a matter of time that more of such backdoors find their way into sensitive government, military, finance and other industrial, IoT and many other applications via COTS programmes.


December 12, 2018 11:21 PM

Anura on New Australian Backdoor Law:

@David Walsh

The section they are referring to is on page 14: "317C Designated communications provider etc."

December 12, 2018 9:37 PM

David Walsh on New Australian Backdoor Law:

Anon

what is s. 317C onwards? There is no Section 3 part 17 , and no Section 317

can you define what you mean specifically?

December 12, 2018 9:06 PM

Bong-Smoking Primitive Monkey-Brained Spook on New Australian Backdoor Law:

New Australian Backdoor

Whiskey Tango Foxtrot? an Outback2door. Should've seen that bugger coming!

December 12, 2018 7:28 PM

Petre Peter on New Australian Backdoor Law:

Australia could also add a governor to every car to make sure no one ever speeds regardless of the burden on honest citizens.

December 12, 2018 7:03 PM

gordo on Friday Squid Blogging: Problems with the Squid Emoji:

@ Faustus,

Something could actually be done about these atrocities if our concerns extended beyond disadvantaged millionaire celebrities. (This is in no way an attack on Colin Kaepernick, who disinterestedly sacrificed money and fame to bring an important issue to light.)

Yet, the Nike ad brought that issue front and center:

...

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December 12, 2018 6:25 PM

David Walsh on New Australian Backdoor Law:

Sancho

good point and one I had considered. Also remember 5 Eyes and Snowden documents re: US alligator clips

Australia is a country, an island and a continent, and some say continues (legally) to be a vassal state of England.


happy to discuss also but not sure the relevance here ;-)

December 12, 2018 6:24 PM

Clive Robinson on New Australian Backdoor Law:

@ David Walsh, 65535,

Choosing to boycott Aus

Apparently the Israeli Government managed to interfere in the legislative processes in other countries to make it in effect illegal to "boycott Israel" and it's goods, because the Israeli politicians see it as an existential threat[1].

Do you think Aus has the same "fifth columnists" to do the same for them?

[1]...

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December 12, 2018 6:13 PM

David Walsh on New Australian Backdoor Law:

someone with technical and other relevant expertise (Nicolas Weaver?) may wish to compile a rough list of all the instances encryption could be legitimately employed for benefit of individuals and society - now weakened - and the potential consequences of this 'systemic weakness'.
The lawmakers are singularly responsible for those consequences.
It's a long list!!

Seperately, note The Tor Project is likely to be affected by this

December 12, 2018 6:04 PM

Impossibly Stupid on New Australian Backdoor Law:

@Michael Gaul

Absent legislation in some markets explicitly forbidding the ability to install such back doors, will security-conscious companies just sacrifice the Australian market? Or will they have a separate product for Australia?

I'm thinking along the same lines as what @tfb posted earlier. Any products produced by or for the Australian market that require encryption to keep them secure/profitable will simply cease to exist. Nobody is going to be eager to do business with, say, a bank with a "separate product" that any criminal...

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December 12, 2018 5:59 PM

Sancho_P on New Australian Backdoor Law:

@David Walsh

Not to visit physically is one thing (funny?), but in “visit” there is a point.
We (others) may not even know when our data is crossing Down Under’s legislation. I’m ready to discuss whether it’s a continent or an island, but Australia is part of the world (wide web).

To catch up with China a lot of infrastructure would have to be changed.

December 12, 2018 5:53 PM

Sancho_P on New Australian Backdoor Law:

@SeeNoEvil

Thanks for the link. Is this an official paper or his private opinion?

Very weak, in point #2 there is a very common “mistake”, the rest seems to be emotionally written:

#1
”But law enforcement and security agencies can only do so in very specific circumstances – with a warrant for example.” (my emph)
+
”Nobody’s personal communications can be accessed under the Act without a warrant, in the same way other legislation has operated for decades.”
- But he said “for example”, are there any other...

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December 12, 2018 5:28 PM

Sancho_P on New Australian Backdoor Law:

@Doug

It seems the Aussies are the first to know of weaknesses in TLS 1.3.
Or is it backdoored already? ;-)

December 12, 2018 5:19 PM

Clive Robinson on New Australian Backdoor Law:

@ All,

It will be intetesting to see how they intend to move beyond the "communications end point"...

If you look at a modern smart phone or other consumer communications capable data device, they are not "segregated" in a way that will stop a suitably resourced attacker getting to the Human Computer Interface (HCI) from the communications channel.

Which means that such an attacker has no need to attack the crypro / stego / other security mechanism, they just by pass it with an End Run Attack.

But such a backdoor only works because the security end point is...

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December 12, 2018 4:08 PM

Clive Robinson on Friday Squid Blogging: Problems with the Squid Emoji:

@ Faustus,

Where is the concern about endemic modern slavery?

Problem number one is "How do you define slavery?", it's realy not as easy as you think. For instance US Prisoners forced to do work for next to nothing... Are they slaves? They think so but the typical response is "But then they would wouldn't they" or "They are not alowed to be involved in politics" or a hundred and one other excuses to keep what is a very profitable status quo...

My view is perhaps a little liberal for many, in that you become a slave when one or more of the...

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December 12, 2018 3:46 PM

David Walsh on New Australian Backdoor Law:

65535

'you will not be vacationing in Aus any time soon'

well, if you did no one would know what you were talking about. They have holidays in Aus - not vacations ;-) Seriously, assuming that what you mean is ' this law
means I will not wish to take a trip to Australia'

Choosing to boycott Aus as a holiday destination as a protest against these laws is one thing - providing you inform relevant authorities (Aus Gov for example) the reason you are witholding your tourist dollars.
But these laws actually imposing upon your experience as a tourist is a...

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December 12, 2018 3:15 PM

Clive Robinson on Friday Squid Blogging: Problems with the Squid Emoji:

@ Wesley Parish,

As I understand it, in the common law countries you cannot be tried for something that was not a crime at the time you did it.

Retrospective legislation should not happen for good and proper reasons, but is not actualy prohibited. Worse in some cases you are actually striped of any defence...

The US is quite happy to push retrospective legislation down other peoples throats when they see a political advantage in doing so. Much as they do by insisting their writ transends all juresdictions, not just for the protection of US...

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December 12, 2018 3:08 PM

bttb on Bad Consumer Security Advice:

@Joao wrote:

"VPN's are useful in Open Wi-Fi/ Wi-Fi not controlled by the user because many hackers try to manipulate traffic in all sorts of ways, and sometimes even attempt to get in into the device if they can... good VPN's (self-hosted in home, or a good company) well configured let everything go securely inside a secure tunnel letting the attacker out of the connection and stop easy manipulation of data (wrong DNS reply's/ strip DNS reply's, strip TLS availability, and many others)"

Thank you for those comments.

Does anybody know if "Wi-Fi hackers" are readily...

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December 12, 2018 2:36 PM

stine on New Australian Backdoor Law:

re: seenoevil

If you substitue "Truth" for "Myth", each of these statements becomes correct:
Truth #1: Your information is no longer safe

December 12, 2018 2:26 PM

Clive Robinson on Friday Squid Blogging: Japanese Squid-Fishing Towns in Decline:

@ vas pup,

With regards the UKs NHS, the ministerial bozos that were in Richmond house, are almost ditectly responsible for the "NHS IT failings".

Thr gradious yet compleatly moronic ideas started with a lunatic think tank of "Ye Sayers" around Tony Blair PM then living in No11 Downing St because No10's flat was "too small".

The worst offender in creating NHS cock-ups of all forms is one Jeremy Hunt who should not be alowed to play with a "piggy bank" let alone the finances of the worlds largest health care computer and other services. To say he is incompetent is...

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December 12, 2018 2:24 PM

David Walsh on Friday Squid Blogging: Problems with the Squid Emoji:

Wesley Parish

Thanks. As is so often the case, I read comments on this blog (and others) that are sufficiently insightful as to beg the question 'those in the newspapers need to know about this factor? Why haven't they thought of it?'

With this in mind, I've flicked Xi an email quoting your comment in full

December 12, 2018 2:17 PM

Doug on New Australian Backdoor Law:

ponderings:

does this include HTTPS?

will the lawmakers find their own secrets spilled and online shopping affected?

Is FOSS with no owner harder to pin down in terms of fines etc?

encryption implict in hardware?

just for a bit of balance, it will be interesting to see how monlithic billion dollar tech companies renowned for saying 'up yours' to human rights and ethical practices may end up suffering. If anyone can't see it - the impossiblity of the conditions laid down here makes this one HUGE can of worms globally, on a macro level

December 12, 2018 2:10 PM

Rach El on New Australian Backdoor Law:

doesn't it just broadcast that people using messaging apps wishing for privacy need to obfuscate with code? as far as work arounds it's not rocket science?


December 12, 2018 1:59 PM

65535 on New Australian Backdoor Law:

"New Australian Backdoor Law"

That is gonzo logic. Nasty stuff. They don’t call it Ozz for nothing. I will not be vacationing in Australia any time soon.

December 12, 2018 1:22 PM

Michael Gaul on New Australian Backdoor Law:

Earlier you wrote about the far reaching effects of local regulations requiring good security, (paraphrasing) that bad security is only profitable if you can get away with it everywhere; once you have to have good security to satisfy one market you might as well do it for everyone. Does this apply in reverse? Absent legislation in some markets explicitly forbidding the ability to install such back doors, will security-conscious companies just sacrifice the Australian market? Or will they have a separate product for Australia? Or will they just decide it is simpler to design their products...

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December 12, 2018 12:54 PM

tfb on New Australian Backdoor Law:

One result of this is pretty obviously going to be the death of the Australian software industry: who would buy a program from, or use the services of, a company working under legislation like that? Financial services companies will presumably be similarly hit. It's a kind of slow suicide by stupidity.

December 12, 2018 12:31 PM

vas pup on New Australian Backdoor Law:

@Theo"but it is selectively enforceable".
I guess @impossible stupid provided good input 'why' in comment above.
Legislators think that they could adopt any Law and it is going to be implemented as they intended. Wrong! Any law which targeted particular technology/science required experts panel hearing BEFORE final vote on such Law in order that all (at least most) vogue moments clarified in such way that exclude selective enforcement. Who are legislator's aids? Could they provide good help having degree in political science or law or humanities in such cases? I doubt....

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December 12, 2018 11:46 AM

Theo on New Australian Backdoor Law:

@Phaete

It's not universally enforceable but it is selectively enforceable. Arbitrary and capricious power masquerading as the rule of law.

December 12, 2018 11:33 AM

Anselm on Security Risks of Chatbots:

I wouldn't worry too much about the remote-controlled cadavers that walk about for periods of weeks spying on people. They should be instantly recognisable by their overpowering BO.

December 12, 2018 11:14 AM

Cassandra on New Australian Backdoor Law:

@Bruce Schneier

Repeating yourself is good when the alternative is people mistaking silence for acquiescence. It is also a feature of the inaccurately* well known dictum that "The price of liberty is eternal vigilance". Tiring as it may be to repeat things, you are likely to be addressing new members of your readership each time, and sometimes reappraising old arguments helps you to sharpen your position: or indeed change it if the facts have changed**.

If nothing else, the consequences of the Australian governments actions will be interesting to follow, much like the...

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December 12, 2018 11:05 AM

Phaete on New Australian Backdoor Law:

Quite unenforceable in this age of worldwide internet shopping.
Unless they want to make a total arse of themselves.

December 12, 2018 11:01 AM

vas pup on Friday Squid Blogging: Japanese Squid-Fishing Towns in Decline:

@all:
Those two articles below caught my attention because both some how 9as my humble understanding) address the redundancy in security.

(1)NHS told to ditch 'absurd' fax machines:
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-46497526

"However, Tim Owen. from Bolton, who works in blood services, asked: "So what happens when a computer virus attacks a hospital's IT infrastructure, as happened recently?

"During the WannaCry attack of 2017 our 'out-dated, redundant' piece of equipment ensured that blood products, not...

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December 12, 2018 10:31 AM

ATN on New Australian Backdoor Law:

Fortunately I still did not activate the banking through Internet password
(to know that password I would need to unglue something on a paper letter).
I have never accepted the small print saying that any bug in any computer whatsoever would be my fault - if interception/message creation can be classified as bug.

December 12, 2018 10:22 AM

metaschima on New Australian Backdoor Law:

It will be interesting to see what happens and how they'll be able to implement this. If successful I'm thinking steganography will be of significant use in the future as well as possibly moving encryption off of regulated systems.

December 12, 2018 10:20 AM

Impossibly Stupid on New Australian Backdoor Law:

I wonder how far all this political stupidity is going to go before the only solution that's left is a scorched earth policy? Why are laws passed that are not adequately defined? Why are representatives elected when they have no understanding of mathematics and science? Why are universities accredited when they produce graduates with this level of ignorance? Why are jobs given to voters who choose to be lead by those fools?

China and Russia are poised to become the next set of superpowers as the old West implodes on itself. An amazing bloodless (if it continues to play out...

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December 12, 2018 9:24 AM

Tom on PayPal Authentication Still Substandard:

Using poor authentication protocols is the least of the things that is wrong with PayPal. They could start by treating their users decently and fairly, and by handling our money and our complaints as a real bank would handle them,.

December 12, 2018 8:55 AM

vas pup on Friday Squid Blogging: Japanese Squid-Fishing Towns in Decline:

@Rach El:
" I can't speak to much of what you wrote but the weaponized drone idea just begs the question - how do you prevent it harming the personnel deploying it?"
It is clear - they are far away of direct contact with violent mob in special operation centers. So, distance matter. Their training should kind of Colonel Grossman suggested (amazing book 'On Killing' - that is military related, but when non-lethal measures applied for violent protesters to suppress violent mob - same psychological paradigm applied). Regarding harming police forces psychologically, I am pro usage...

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December 12, 2018 8:37 AM

Faustus on Friday Squid Blogging: Problems with the Squid Emoji:

@ Clive

I agree, the leadership of groups militating for marginalized people has a strange tendency to end up in the hands of the privileged.

Militating for the underserved, who in most cases do have actual concerns that should be addressed, ends up being abstracted to the point where privileged leaders gain power and influence while the underserved remain underserved.

Where is the concern about endemic modern slavery? https://www.antislavery.org/slavery-today/modern-slavery/ About rampant...

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December 12, 2018 3:47 AM

Wesley Parish on Friday Squid Blogging: Problems with the Squid Emoji:

@Clive Robinson, David Walsh

Just a point on the recent arrest of Huawei’s chief financial officer, Meng Wanzhou that Canada has apparently not noticed.

After the agreement with Iran to cease uranium processing to a near-weapons concentration of U235, the US and the EU and other nations relaxed sanctions.

As I understand it, in the common law countries you cannot be tried for something that was not a crime at the time you did it. If I fly a light plane under a harbour bridge the day before Parliament passes the law that outlaws it, I cannot be charged with that as...

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December 12, 2018 12:05 AM

Rach El on Friday Squid Blogging: Japanese Squid-Fishing Towns in Decline:

Vas Pup

In the context of public protests encountering official opposition and enforcement of order. It is worth appreciating that France has an entirely different relationship and perspective in this regard than the US.Civil protest is part of the fabric of France,even to the point of absurdity. The US popularly has an attitude of 'quell the protests, knock them down as one would a wildfire'. It is not so in France. Politicians understand the fine line they need to tread in addressing and handling the voice and manifestation of dissent. Now, no one is agreeing with injury to...

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December 11, 2018 11:48 PM

Rach El on Friday Squid Blogging: Japanese Squid-Fishing Towns in Decline:

Clive & Vas Pup

" means a very limited range of "effective" between dangerous/lethal and annoying/usless.

the latter end of the spectrum can end up being antagonistic, think of the proverbial 'bear with a sore head' or what I've heard pepper spray being like for those it doesn't immobilise - it makes them more psycho

Thanks for the 'kettling' link, interesting to read it's been repeatedly challenged in the courts.

Vas Pup

what you are describing sounds sinister to me but I appreciate what you are driving toward. You are saying 'whats a peaceful...

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December 11, 2018 10:32 PM

Clive Robinson on Bad Consumer Security Advice:

@ La Abeja, Joao,

He holds a complete patent on that entire branch of mathematics and number theory.

Only in limited places.

Also patents can be challenged if overly broad or the claims are not quite right.

Also there are other tricks, if people are shown to be stopping progress.

The history of crypto patents has often not been a good one for the patent holders.

Back in 2007 Our host @Bruce had this to say on ECC patents,

    Certicom certainly can claim ownership of ECC. The algorithm was developed and patented by...

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December 11, 2018 3:16 PM

La Abeja on Bad Consumer Security Advice:

@Joao: authenticate users because of the use of Ed25519 elliptic curve technology

It's probably okay, but the guy that came up with some of that stuff or at least widely published it is a little too pompous and people cannot even dare talk about it, let alone critically review it, without just the right college frat-boy credentials.

It's infuriating. There's a pistol-packing, mace-wielding university PhD, and that's his turf. Don't you dare study elliptic curves without his permission. He holds a complete patent on that entire branch of mathematics and number theory.

December 11, 2018 1:52 PM

AT on Your Personal Data is Already Stolen:

Does this make a case for the ethics of data poisoning - providing deliberately fake information to companies (in possible breach of their terms of service)?

December 11, 2018 12:42 PM

gordo on 2018 Annual Report from AI Now:

@Sancho_P, Bruce, Humdee, (@Impossibly Stupid, just now seeing your post),

Considering the issues at hand, and their socio-technical nature, maybe the word prejudice is the more precise social construct, with bias working as its technical euphemism. Rewording the sentence, then, we see the problem:

It is misleading to say that prejudice is a social problem.

As Henry George put it, above:

There is danger in reckless change; but greater danger in blind conservatism.

The danger we face comes as the two combine....

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December 11, 2018 12:32 PM

Faustus on 2018 Annual Report from AI Now:

@ Impossibly

If anything, an actual AI might be the thing that gets us away from faulty human thinking and blind ambition. The greater danger is not that smart machines will enslave us, but that megalomaniacal sociopaths will continue to use dumb machines to do that. Intelligence, in any form, is not what a ruling party wants as a check to their power.

This is an interesting reversal of thought. We have started assuming AIs are dangerous. Maybe that is an incorrect assumption.

I think the questions hinges on whether fairness can be discovered...

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December 11, 2018 12:04 PM

Impossibly Stupid on 2018 Annual Report from AI Now:

@Humdee

Bias is a life necessity.

You are conflating judgement with prejudice. The former is a valid part of life, but the latter is the problem that is actually being discussed when people talk about bias. Machine learning is only presented with a subset of data, which itself is often skewed based on artifacts of historical prejudice. And since it isn't AI, it doesn't have the ability to question the completeness or accuracy of that data. It can be very wrong about its conclusions, but lacks the ability to detect its own mistakes;...

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December 11, 2018 11:34 AM

vas pup on 2018 Annual Report from AI Now:

Artificial synapses made from nanowires:
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/12/181205133928.htm

"Scientists from Jülich together with colleagues from Aachen and Turin have produced a memristive element made from nanowires that functions in much the same way as a biological nerve cell. The component is able to both save and process information, as well as receive numerous signals in parallel. The resistive switching cell made from oxide crystal nanowires is thus proving to be the ideal...

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December 11, 2018 10:56 AM

Faustus on 2018 Annual Report from AI Now:

@ Jurgen

Great link. I agree that ham-fistedly inserting an anti-bias bias into the input or results of an AI will ruin the optimization. I suspect that people will want to preserve any bias that benefits protected groups so cleansing the data of protected data and its proxies probably won't be satisfactory.

I think the most promising approach is to adjust the scoring (aka reward) function to add a compensatory value to adjust the score based on evidence of prior bias.

But will this "affirmative action" be accepted by the majority? Will it have unexpected negative consequences?

December 11, 2018 10:03 AM

Sancho_P on 2018 Annual Report from AI Now:

@Bruce, Humdee, gordo

Maybe the word “problem” should not be in the sentence at all.
“Problem” (*here*) generally means something unpleasant, but bias is not:
It is the reason why some survive and others don’t.

Bias is pleasant, esp. if we recognize that it is bias.
It’s easy to spot in others but we have problems to notice our own.

December 11, 2018 10:02 AM

vas pup on Friday Squid Blogging: Japanese Squid-Fishing Towns in Decline:

@Clive and Rech:
https://richardalanmiller.com/mind-control-weapons-artifical-telepathy-silent-sound-spread-spectrum/
SSSS technology have capability of precision targeting of particular person when he/she hearing voices, but person next to - does not. In riot situation is important to target violent individuals/instigators selectively kind of remove fuse out of the riot bomb. I guess (by I am not expert in physics as Clive) it is possible to: combine LRAD with...

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December 11, 2018 9:27 AM

vas pup on Friday Squid Blogging: Japanese Squid-Fishing Towns in Decline:

@Clive and Rach El:
I was thinking about LRAD which was successfully used by US National Guard to suppress violence recently. It could be precise and regulate power output to prevent casualties.
In France during WWII guerillas effective pioneered in development and used stench bombs and grenade as non-lethal weapon against German occupational forces. In Israel they have Skunk - same kind of stench agent - you can't stand it and attire keep the smell for so long, you can't use it and have to dispose. It could be applied as water cannon, but I am in favor of future application...

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December 11, 2018 9:19 AM

Faustus on 2018 Annual Report from AI Now:

@ Bruce

This is your house and I have no intention of being contentious with you here. I appreciate that you share this forum.

I personally can't think of any recent internet regulation that has actually been helpful, rather than decreasing liberty on the net and shoring up monopolies. Based on your posts I think you generally agree. FOSTA, for example, is causing all sorts of limitations on personal expression.

I guess net neutrality was the last regulation that seemed helpful, may it rest in peace. Surprisingly its demise hasn't yet seemed to have much...

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December 11, 2018 9:13 AM

Clive Robinson on Friday Squid Blogging: Problems with the Squid Emoji:

@ RG-2,

is AI naturally psychopathic?

There is no definitive medical test, and the use of psychopath was changed to sociopath to emphasise the outcome of their behaviours. Then they ment two similar but different things and so on. Which is maybe why the DSM nolonger uses the terms.

The upshot is there are several lists of "Diagnostic criteria" that you do not need multiple doctorates etc to use. Thus a rational person could score the behaviour of the A.I. against any of the lists...

The fun points however are items such as "empathy" and...

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December 11, 2018 8:31 AM

Clive Robinson on Friday Squid Blogging: Problems with the Squid Emoji:

@ David,

1500 AT Commands?

Give or take. There is a common agreed core set, then there are add ons, some do more or less the same thing but have a different interface, and some are just off the wall.

So if you stick to just one manufacturer of RF Modem then you will see a less, many of which you can ignore as well as you probably won't use them.

Further as time goes on the standardisation process pulls older multiple similar comands into one standard command. The example where it's easy to see this is where GPS went from being optional to...

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December 11, 2018 8:17 AM

Clive Robinson on Your Personal Data is Already Stolen:

@ vas pup,

Who am I to argue with TJ, he seems quite a sensible chap on this issue ;-)

More seriously though he and others have predicted what certain people will do if they get their hands on such powers.

One way to spot such people is the way they speak about both true and representational democracy, because it is in effect their enemy.

The fact others get "hoodwinked" into their plans is a fairly well established fact (Remember Germans democratically voted to get rid of ellections back in the 1930's). Due I suspect to the way many get educated they don't...

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December 11, 2018 7:56 AM

Clive Robinson on Friday Squid Blogging: Japanese Squid-Fishing Towns in Decline:

@ Rach El, vas pup,

perhaps they are not certifiable safe - and how do the personnel deploying them remain unaffected?

Good questions to ask, and I think the answer is that they are neither safe thus not certifiable[1].

The problem is the target (AKA the human) has a quite narrow range between ineffective and dangerous levels of energy delivered by directed forces, where such weapons are "effective".

If you look at "radient energy" sources their output follows a 1/(r^2) drop off as you would expect. Which with a narrow band of "effective"...

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December 11, 2018 7:25 AM

RG-2 on Friday Squid Blogging: Problems with the Squid Emoji:

IBM Pits Natural Computer Against Human Debaters
'IBM pitted a computer against two human debaters in the first public demonstration of artificial intelligence technology it’s been working on for more than five years. The computer delivered its opening argument by pulling in evidence from its huge internal repository of newspapers, journals and other sources[1]. It then listened to a professional human debater’s counter-argument and spent four minutes rebutting it [2]
Google and Microsoft’s Bing use similar technology to digest and summarize written content and compose new...

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